
"Stop Writing Dead Programs" by Jack Rusher (Strange Loop 2022)
About this video
Jack Rusher's Strange Loop 2022 talk argues that most programming languages are still designed around punchcard-era assumptions. He makes the case for live, interactive programming environments, drawing on Lisp, Smalltalk and REPL-driven development.
Why it appears in the archive
HN returns to it constantly as the talk on live programming and what modern tooling is missing, though a few found it too much.
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From the Hacker News discussion
Live development is still so under-explored, and is just so exciting to work with. One of my favorite talks is "Stop Writing Dead Programs" ( [VIDEO] ) and touches on a lot of what could be in terms of live development. Lisp is very well-suited to live development due to code being data, but live development doesn't need to be lispy. I built a live development extension for Love2D which lets you do graphics livecoding (both lua and glsl) in real-time - every keystroke updating the output, (if a valid program). [LINK] Here are some (early) demos of things you can do with it: [LINK] So many cool things once you break down the barrier between editor and running program. I've also asked myself the question of, what would a language look like that was natively built for live development, and built out a prototype - though it's definitely a sandbox so haven't posted it anywhere yet, other than demos on mastadon.
Read original comment ↗Because we live in a free society and smoking is a proper right. It is unhealthy and largely outdated habit but if you want to light a cigarette, you can. Programming in C++ is also an outdated habit. There are better languages, better technologies, and there are generally better ways to create software than writing code, compiling the code, replacing std::abs with abs (real issue, these are different functions) and recompiling the code again. But writing in a horrible language is a proper right as well. People write in Brainfuck for fun and good for them! Jack Rusher sums up what better programming looks like in his Strange Loop talk [VIDEO]
Read original comment ↗Your "unpopular rant" (or one pretty much like it) has 376k views and 12k likes on youtube![1] (Recommended watch, not least for demystifying the origin of vi's navigation keys and the choice of ~/ for /home/you.) 1: [VIDEO] (link jumps to 16:52)
Read original comment ↗I believe this to be an artifact of our current paradigm of software development, which is based purely around static "batch processing" where the software can't be molded easily. (I didn't want it to come off as a plug, so I didn't add it to my original message, but I'm working on something to solve that.) To get a better idea of what I think is the better approach, check out these talks: Tudor Gîrba - Moldable development - [LINK] Jack Rusher - Stop Writing Dead Programs - [VIDEO]
Read original comment ↗It's pretty much impossible to explain to people what it's like to work in a CL environment. A good presentation on what we're missing: [VIDEO]
Read original comment ↗> trying to understand what's happening in code is even harder It's different in Lisp because you basically program a thing from the inside out, meaning that you don't just read the code from top to bottom. Instead, you constantly evaluate expressions and expand macros while going through it. It's practically like playing a game, and there's a good amount of fun. People often dismiss Lisps (Clojure, CL, Fennel, Racket, etc.) after reading Lisp code without any connected REPL and often don't even grasp what makes it so awesome. It's like disliking food after seeing it for the first time in a cooking show on TV. Good talk of relevance: "Stop Writing Dead Programs by Jack Rusher" [VIDEO]
Read original comment ↗> simple examples comparing Lisp ... that illustrate the benefits of using Lisp over another language It depends on what you're trying to get out of it. For example, you can grab a simple code of some React components with JSX and ask ChatGPT to write it in Hiccup (Clojure). That would show you how s-expressions can reduce the syntax boilerplate and make it smaller. You can do the same thing with Lua and Fennel - Fennel code would be much shorter and cleaner. However, without proper understanding and using structural editing and connected REPL, you probably won't see any benefits right away. Lisp code is not the best to be read off the "dead medium" - paper or screen. It's better when you have a connected REPL because it allows you to evaluate every single expression on the fly. Instead of trying to understand what (foo x y z) means, you can evaluate it and immediately see the results. With a connected REPL, you can evaluate them separately (individually), or together. Good talk of relevance: "Stop Writing Dead Programs by Jack Rusher" [VIDEO] Next step in understanding the benefits of Lisp code is learning structural editing. Because everything is a symbolic expression, you can easily move, transpose, change, and replace parts of your program. Instead of rewriting a function of seemingly arbitrary syntax constructs, you'll be dealing with well-structured forms that you can easily move around. No, it not the same, better or worse than using refactoring features of your IDE wi
Read original comment ↗Hi I think is in the hypothesis (I'm not sure) of that we have edition made by the pdp 11 keyboard developer and tooling that's old and design whiout introspection in mind showcase in this video, the video is really cool but little bit long [VIDEO]
Read original comment ↗